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#exvangelical

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The LLMentalist Effect: how chat-based Large Language Models replicate the mechanisms of a psychic’s con
softwarecrisis.dev/letters/llm

First of all, I am open minded enough to believe that there could be few people that have genuine psychic abilities, such as some non-verbal autistic kids. And, I had a friend that I had known since high school, who confided in me that since he'd had a near death experience he could see (but not hear) what he believed to be dead people, and yes I realize there are multiple possible explanations for that but the point is he wasn't telling many people about it and as far as I know he wasn't conning anyone. But that said, I found this article fascinating, both because it helps explain the sudden emergence and big push toward #AI but also because it immediately struck me that there could be parallels in some religious experiences.

MANY years ago, I would say in the '70's, I was in a #church "revival" meeting where the "evangelist" was performing just like a #psychic would, except he claimed he was doing his work by the power of God. He'd start out with general statements like "someone here has a lower back problem" (a VERY common issue) and if someone responded he's call them up to the stage and do his ritual and claim they were healed (it often culminated with him tapping someone on the forehead, saying "The power of God", and they would fall over backwards, of course there were always a couple of strong guys ready to catch the falling person. I won't go into all the mechanics of it (there are probably whole books about it), but at one point he got brave enough to tell everyone the audience to hold hands, and then he went down the center aisle tapping the person at the end of each row on the forehead (while saying "The Power of God" over and over), and the entire row would fall backwards into their seats.

So when he got to the row I was in, I was waiting for this supernatural power to hit. The people closest to the evangelist fell back. I did not, because I didn't feel a thing. Then the people on the other side of me, after waiting a second for me to fall backwards, started falling anyway. AND the two people on my sides started tugging on my hands, like I should fall, but I didn't - for me it had to be the real supernatural power, or I was standing firm! I looked around and noticed a few other people still standing (mostly behind me, maybe I had inspired a few others to be truthful?) but still I couldn't get over how gullible some of these people were. If there was a genuine power of God, I was pretty sure it wasn't being manifested though this guy.

Two takeaways from this: You can knock people all you want for believing that some psychics may be genuine, or that AI's may be gaining some form of intelligence, but so many people have been conditioned to believe that supernatural things are possible by their religions. And I am not flatly saying they are always wrong, but I would also say there is a much higher percentage of charlatans and frauds among religious types, especially in the so called "evangelical" churches such as those that have gone gaga over Trump and his minions. If there was ever a candidate for an "antichrist", Trump or Musk could certainly qualify, but I digress.

And the other thing is that I wish young people could be taught to recognize these types of cons starting at an early age, since in at least some cases these are a precursor to drawing them into a #cult. Far too many kids are kept ignorant of these things until they become young adults, at which point they are ripe for the picking by some unscrupulous cult leader (of which there are many more now that they can proselytize using social media and YouTube).

Out of the Software CrisisThe LLMentalist Effect: how chat-based Large Language Models rep…The new era of tech seems to be built on superstitious behaviour
Replied in thread

@dan

"Forsake not you're gathering..."

But with whom?

"Before I ever worked in big churches, I helped run Christian camps..."

The business of faith is a problem. It lead to marriage with politics.

The view that "God trains those called, avoids calling those trained." is meaningful in so many ways.

(CW: Member only, after tasting the top)

medium.com/backyard-theology/w

#Exvangelical, #Sunday, #SilentSunday

Backyard Church · Why the Church Keeps Failing the Ones Who Need It MostBy Dan Foster

We can't retain hope in the fight for progress if we only look at the state of politics.

Institutional waves are more meaningful. Individual growth even moreso, and these changes spread outward in ripples. THAT is anarchy to me. That is the principle of Mutual Aid applied to influence and cultural momentum.

But it takes time. It took this kid years to make the decision to read this letter to his Seminary (LDS high school religious education). And now this will sink deep into some of the other kids' minds. They will resist it, dismiss this act and dehumanize its actor, but the memory of it will surface over and over and they will ponder its meaning.

It can only change some of them, and it will take years and many other disconfirming events for them to take a similar plunge. But some will, indeed, themselves walk out of the cave. And maybe make a fuss on their exit.

This is activism. Not one hero riding in to save the day, not one prophet standing on the walls of Zarahemla under a rain of arrows, but each individual choosing the right as they learn it, one inch at a time.

reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments

Some people leave the LDS Church individually. I was one of those.

But it's fascinating the times when it becomes a group project, when one's own doubts are generated by the doubts or struggles of others. It's less common perhaps, but it sometimes happens for couples and in close-knit extended families that don't immediately disown the first doubter.

It happened in the case of John Dehlin and tens of thousands of his Mormon Stories audience. As he tried to grapple with issues in a faith promoting way, his doubts grew, his listeners' doubts grew, and then when the Church excommunicated him, he took most of them with him.

Same with my client Natasha Helfer, on a smaller, more private scale. As she helped her therapeutic clients with faith crisis, or even just saw their pain trying so hard to live up to impossible ideals, or doing what the Church said and having tragic results, she learned from them, and they learned from her.

Until they excommunicated her, too.

It seems like they really don't like that, and will excommunicate the figurehead of this process.

But all those invisible participants are just as much part of it. It's a collective thing. It wasn't Dehlin or Helfer who "led them astray." It was the falseness of Church claims, and the people collectively figuring that out by the mirrors they held up to each other.

As someone who has #deconstructed from both Christianity and liberalism, it saddens and mystifies me when #exvangelical friends aren't able to take the next logical step.

Just like the Church, the State is a system of hegemonic control, maintained through propaganda, and claiming to benefit the people. You saw through one lie. Why not this one, too? 😢

Growing up Catholic with evangelicals in my family, I knew the animosity the latter held for the former.

They seemed to like the then Pope for his anti communist bonafides.

Now that one they don’t like dies, you can see the animosity the right wing evangelicals have for them.